Questioner Nine: How do you use the
discount rate to calculate intrinsic value?
Charlie Munger: We don’t use numeric formulas that way. We take into
account quality factors. It’s like a bridge hand, you have to think about a lot
of things. There is never going to be a formula. If that worked, every
mathematical person would be rich, but that’s not the way it works.
Q9
-a:請問您如何使用折現率估計公司的內部價值?
查理.蒙格:事實上,我們從不使用類似的數學公式,我們考慮的構成公司品質的所有因素。就像打橋牌,你必須考慮很多情況。從來沒有任何公式可以套用到牌局裡頭。如果能有這樣一個公式,所有的數學家必定能一夕致富,但這畢竟不是現實世界運作的方式。
Questioner Nine: But you value a
company…
Charlie Munger: Opportunity cost
is crucial, and the risk free rate is one factor.
Q9
-b:但您曾經評估一個公司的價值?
查理.蒙格:你必須考慮機會成本、還有無風險利率。
Questioner Nine: Do you use the
same rate for different businesses?
Charlie Munger: The answer is no,
of course not, different businesses need different rates. They all are
viewed in terms of value, and they’re weighed one against another. But a
person will pay more for a good business than for a lousy one. We really don’t want
any lousy businesses anymore. We used to make money betting on
reinventing lousy businesses and kind of wringing money out of them, but
that is a really painful, difficult way to make money, especially if you’re
already rich. We don’t do much of it anymore.
We used to make money betting on reinventing lousy
businesses and kind of wringing money out of them, but that is a really
painful, difficult way to make money, especially if you’re already rich.
We don’t do much of it anymore.
Sometimes we do it by accident, cause one of our businesses
turns lousy, and in that case it’s like dealing with your relatives you can’t
get rid of. We deal with those as best we can, but we’re out looking for new
ones.
Q9
-c:您會對不同企業使用相同的利率嗎?
查理.蒙格:當然不會,不同的企業必須有不同的利率。他們都根據自身的價值來評估,並且需要分開來各自權衡。人們向來習慣為好公司支付更多。我們再也不想要接觸任何糟糕的企業。
我們過去曾經投資過那些糟糕的企業,希望他們奮力一搏,然後為我們帶來可觀的收益。不過事實證明這個賭注過於痛苦,過於困難。特別如果你已經非常富裕了,你大可不必這麼做。我們已經不再這樣做了。
但偶爾,我們還是會遇到一些意外,因為我們有的生意會變得很糟糕,這就像是遇到不好的親戚,但你去無法將他擺脫。我們就必須儘可能好好處理這些糟糕的企業,當然,我們同時也會尋找新的替代方案。
以下是另一個版本的問答內容:
Questioner: My question: As an investor, what do you use
to value a business or a company? How do you use the discount rate to
calculate intrinsic value?
Munger: Obviously, it’s relevant
what the return you get on your bonds is; that affects the value of other
assets in the general climate. Obviously, your opportunity costs should cover
your own investment decision making. If you happen to have a rich uncle who
will sell you his business for 10% of what it’s worth, you don’t want to think
about some other investment. If the opportunity cost is so great, considering
everything else, you should forget about it. And most people don’t pay enough
attention to opportunity cost. Bridge players know about opportunity cost.
Poker players know about opportunity cost. But in an MBA faculty members and
other important people, they hardly know their ass from a plate of hot squash.
問題:作為一個投資者,你用什麼來評估一個企業或一個公司?你如何利用折現率來計算內在價值?
查理.蒙格:很明顯,這就如同你的債券會給你什麼樣的回報,會直接影響到其它資產的價值在同樣的條件之下。顯然,你自己的投資決策應該包含機會成本的考量。如果你有一個有錢的叔叔,他要把他的生意賣給你,而且價格是總價值的10%而已,你不需要再考慮其他的投資。如果機會成本是如此之大,其它所有的考慮項目你都應該忘記它。但大多數人並不重視機會成本。橋牌的玩家都知道機會成本。撲克玩家知道機會成本。但在工商管理學院(MBA)的教職員工和其他重要的人都不重視機會成本的觀念。
Questioner: When you try to arrive at a valuation number
using the discount rate, does it mean that between the two rates …
Munger: We don’t use numeric formulas that way. We
take into account a whole lot of factors. It’s a multi-factor thing. And there
are tradeoffs between factors. It’s just like a bridge hand. You have to think
of a lot of different things at once. There’s never going to be a formula that
will make you rich just by going through some horrible process. If that were
true, every mathematical nerd who gets A’s in algebra would be rich. So you
have to be comfortable thinking about a lot of things at once, and correctly
thinking about a lot of things at once. And we don’t have a formula that will
help you. And all that stuff is relevant. Opportunity cost, of course, is
crucial. And, of course, the risk-free rate is a factor.
問題:當你嘗試使用折現率來估算價值時,兩個不同利率代表………
查理.蒙格:我們不會如此使用數字公式。我們會考量很多因素。這是一個得試圖綜合許多因素的評估方式。而且每個因素之間都會有權衡高低的考量。它就像橋牌,你必須一次思考很多不同的周遭因素。永遠不會有一個公式將會使你富有。如果真的有這樣的公式,那每一個數學天才不就都可以致富。所以你得一次就能思考很多因素,而且還得是正確的思考。我們沒有一個能幫助你的公式。當然,機會成本是至關重要的。無風險利率也是一個重要的考量因素。
註解:
透過以上的問答內容,我們可以歸納出以下幾項重點:
1.
評估一家公司的內在價值,考量的不止是由數字所計算出來的數字,還得去思考許多其它的內在與外在因素,例如:
甲、領導人值得信任嗎?
乙、我們能理解這個行業嗎?
丙、這家公司的競爭優勢是什麼?可以好很久嗎?
丁、考量內在因素與外在因素後,它會持續成長?
戊、會出現什麼樣的問題?
己、公司需要持續增資才能繼續運作嗎?
庚、它經得起風暴來臨時的打擊嗎?
2.
使用折現利益率來計算內在價值,得考量無風險的利率與機會成本的概念,一般情況下,資產的價值是由無風險利率來推動的,正如巴菲特所說,“無風險利率的作用如同資產價格的地心力”,無風險利率低,則有風險的資產價格就會高,無風險的利率高,則有風險的資產價格則會低。
3.
使用折現利益率來計算內在價值,也得考量機會成本的概念,意思就是說,即使我們有機會獲得一項可以擁有15%報酬率的資產,如果我們知道另一個資產卻可以提供更高的25%報酬率時,我們應該捨棄15%報酬率的資產,並且全力投入可以產生25%報酬率的資產。
4.
這個世界沒有所謂的單一公式可以運用在所有事情之上,至少以投資的角度而言,沒有絕對的公式可以使你致富,因為需要考量的因素會隨著人、時、地的不同而有所不同,試圖聽從或遵守一個既定的公式,只會使你的表現平庸。
5.
投資股市,所買的公司股票務必得是一家具有相當高競爭優勢的第一級公司,那些次級的公司,最好不要碰。
6.
不同條件的公司,所考量的折現率會有所不同,好的公司,折現率的要求可能低些,平庸的公司,折現率的要求要高些。
沒有留言:
張貼留言